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Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

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  • Hagen
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Originally posted by avinsider View Post
    Hagen,
    When does VUDU anticipate having HDMI 1.3 output so you can then support Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD audio?
    As has beend said before, we can't just roll this out as a software update since our current hardware can not support HDMI 1.3.

    That's also a reason why we won't deliver content any time soon with other codecs (existing boxes couldn't play it back).

    Another reason are the higher bandwidth requirements for higher quality audio codecs - e.g. I doubt that people would be impressed if we used the same bandwidth that we use for the video portion for audio (read our SD video quality with high def audio at the current bandwidth of our HD content).

    Having said that, once higher bandwidth is available to more households then we might re-consider our options. And by then we should also have HW out in the field that supports HDMI 1.3 or the next generation video connector...

    Hagen.

    Leave a comment:


  • aaronwt
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    DTS-HD makes the most sense because it has a core element that can be played for legacy equipment.
    But it would be nice just to be able to bitstream the existing DD+ audio so it doesn't have to be transcoded to DD for output.

    I know the bitstreamed audio from HD DVD/BD sounds very good, especially the lossless codecs.

    Leave a comment:


  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Originally posted by avinsider View Post
    Hagen,
    When does VUDU anticipate having HDMI 1.3 output so you can then support Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD audio?
    I'm not hagen but there are two issues:

    1.) The current Vudu hardware does not support 1.3 nor anything above DD5.1 AFAIK.

    2.) The datastream requirements for higher audio levels gets significant. People have enough trouble in a lot of places being able to get 4 Mb/sec so they can view HD content. From what I understand, adding on the higher level audio content would significantly increase the bandwidth required. You'd really need to be able to send all the different audio formats at once because what if someone doesn't have DD TrueHD or DTS-HD equipment but DD5.1 equipment? They'd need the 5.1 stream. So you start sending a lot of redundant audio content. Or you'd need to have another set of files on the box that have the high level audio only vs. DD5.1. Then it could start getting confusing to the consumer as to what selection to pick.

    Perhaps the Vudu 2.0 hardware (whenever that may be) will be HDMI 1.3 capable. But right now it is not.

    Leave a comment:


  • avinsider
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Hagen,
    When does VUDU anticipate having HDMI 1.3 output so you can then support Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD audio?

    Leave a comment:


  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Originally posted by intelleq View Post
    Why can't I get DD5.1 to play out of the toslink? My reciever, which normally decodes 5.1 from my DVD player or Cable box doesn't see 5.1 out of the VuDu box.
    I don't know if you are still having this, but go into your Audio settings on the Vudu and make sure the Dolby Digital is enabled on the audio connection or connections you wish to use...

    Leave a comment:


  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Originally posted by Nded View Post
    What movie were you playing? I get 5.1 out of my Vudu just fine.
    To further clarify what Ed is saying: Not all movies and content is in DD5.1. If the movie says "Stereo", then it will simply output PCM via Toslink. If the movie says "Surround Sound" then it certainly should be in 5.1. Please verify that. If you tried a movie in Surround Sound and didn't get 5.1, then we have more to work through.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nded
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Originally posted by intelleq View Post
    Why can't I get DD5.1 to play out of the toslink? My reciever, which normally decodes 5.1 from my DVD player or Cable box doesn't see 5.1 out of the VuDu box.

    What movie were you playing? I get 5.1 out of my Vudu just fine.

    Leave a comment:


  • intelleq
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Why can't I get DD5.1 to play out of the toslink? My reciever, which normally decodes 5.1 from my DVD player or Cable box doesn't see 5.1 out of the VuDu box.

    Leave a comment:


  • mhausig
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Its pretty easy to figure out. There is a list of DD-EX movies here.
    http://www.spannerworks.net/reference/10_9a.asp

    If you have one of these movies and play it with a digital feed to a receiver with DD-EX capablity, the receiver should normally identify the EX flag and will display that it is decoding DD-EX rather than just DD.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hagen
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Thanks again for bringing the EX issue up. Dolby also told me that the EX flag should be preserved during transcoding.

    Unfortunately we don't get much information from the studios regarding the audio streams that we get with the movies. So, right now we don't know if the 5.1 signal is EX encoded or not.

    But we are working on figuring that out...

    Hagen.

    Leave a comment:


  • mhausig
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Check out 15 on the DD+ Faq http://www.dolby.com/assets/pdf/tech...DDPlus_FAQ.pdf
    You should be able to encode a DD-EX stream. The output will still be a 5.1 DD stream over SPDIF but a receiver with DD-EX will be able to decode the rear channel signal.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hagen
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Looking through the documentation it doesn't look like DD-EX is supported in the DD+ to DD transcoding process. But I'll check with Dolby about that...

    I also read up more on the case where DD+ has more than 5.1 channels and the transcoding to DD in that case.

    The DD+ signal for channel configurations higher than 5.1 channels contains a 5.1 downmix of the multichannel configuration. It also contains extra data to recreate the additional channels. When the signal gets transcoded to 5.1 channel DD, the transcoder has only to work with the already existing 5.1 channel downmix. And it does not have to do the downmix during the transcoding.

    If my explanation makes you look like this then you might want to check Dolby's website. Since they invented it, they might also be better than me in explaining it.

    For our box it would make sense to support DD+ via HDMI with higher channel configurations in the future. But that might require new hardware...

    Leave a comment:


  • mhausig
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    So basically, DD+ is your container format but what goes in to the encoding and comes out of the box is DD. There is a 6.1 channel Dolby format that is essentially matrixes the rear channels to create a back channel. I believe it is DD-EX. Not too many movies use it but it would be nice to see it used on Vudu since to my understanding it will play as standard DD for receivers that lack a DD-EX decoder.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hagen
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Sorry for the probably too short version... So here is the long story:

    We us Dolby Digital Plus (DD+) to encode the audio for all our movies. We will encode whatever audio we get from the studios (right now it's either stereo or 5.1).

    HDMI in general can carry Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby Digital (DD), other Dolby Digital flavors, multiple channel PCM audio, different flavors of DTS and other forms of compressed audio.

    Different HDMI devices might support different types of audio. Recieving devices (e.g. TVs, AV recievers) report to a signal source what formats they support (and quite a few of them lie about it, but that's a different storry). Also different versions of the HDMI standard support different audio types.

    The VUDU box can only support Dolby Digital and stereo PCM over HDMI. We support the same audio formats on the coax and optical S/PDIF audio outputs.

    So for the surround sound output on our box we transcode DD+ to DD (at 640 kb/s). The transcoding is well defined by Dolby and is also being tested as part of the Dolby certification process.

    I'm not 100% sure what happens when DD+ content with more than 5.1 channels (DD+ supports up to 13.1 channels) gets transcoded. I'm assuming that the extra channels will be downmixed into a 5.1 channel configuration.

    Let me know if you have more questions,

    Hagen.

    Leave a comment:


  • NA9D
    replied
    Re: Wow, cant believe that the studio did this...

    Not really...

    Are you saying that HDMI only supports DD5.1?

    And what is DD+? Why doesn't HDMI support it? Could higher DD formats be supported then over optical or coax?

    Leave a comment:

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